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Kait and JJ bring in the one and only Sam Collier to dive into the difficult and sensitive topic of divorce and kids.
Introduction
Did you have pre-conceived ideas or assumptions about people in the church who had been divorced? What led you to that way of thinking?
Where do you think the church fails in making safe space for people who are divorced? Do you see narratives that are not being debunked?
Should being divorced be a red flag? To what extent?
Some people make this a DEALBREAKER, why do you think that is problematic?
Hey hey hey HOD famm! We’re back with a super sweet and special podcast episode in this season of red flags. We have the one and only Sam Collier on this week to talk about such an important and sensitive topic, divorce and also children. Let’s jump into this week episode now!
Sam was on the stage a lot at a big church at the time he met Toni before she was divorced. He actually tried to get her to reconcile with her husband before she got divorced. Everything on paper told Sam that he maybe shouldn’t go into this relationship with Toni. So yes, he did have SOME pre-conceived ideas/assumptions about people in the church who had been divorced.
Some of Sam’s story is that he was adopted at two months old. The huge kicker here is that this was actually his dad’s third marriage and his mom’s second marriage. When it comes to Sam’s thoughts on divorce, he’s quick to say he doesn’t hate his parents and that he grew up in a healthy and Christian home.
To sum it up, Sam’s answer to the question is yes and no.
We don’t ever want to glorify divorce however, we do beleive there are some reasons that divorce would be appropriate.
Sam has four “A’s” to consider around divorce. Adultry, Addiction, Abuse, and Abandonment.
Basically, the question to ask is would the heart of God say stay in these moments?
We have two problems in the church: 1) We’re telling people to leave too soon and 2) We’re telling people to stay too long.
It becomes a big issue when someone completely writes someone who is divorced off without ANY curiosity.
Every divorce is so uniquely different that there is no way to compare one divorced person to the next divorced person.
Some quick statistics:
Yes! The reasonable category of theologians and pastors develop appropriately over the years and over generations. Every generation we learn more about the Bible. Naturally you’re going to progress theolologically. The trick is not progressing for progressive sake, but BUILDING on top of what is foundational. It’s finding a deeper truth to the truth, not replacing truth. The majority of pastors have built on top of what is foundational and been a safe place to divorced people.
First and foremost, before focusing on their divorce, I would focus on who they are. Ask questions like, would we be friends? Do I even like you? If we’re not careful we won’t actually get to know people instead we’ll let things in someone’s journey be the focal point.
Sam and Toni would say that they should’ve waited longer to get married. The average time before remarriage for a divorcee is three years. This isn’t prescriptive advice but a few well respected pastors would say a year or two years at least before remarriage. It gives space for healing and processing personally before the next romantic connection. This is hard for singles because we don’t understand the other side of it. The thing is that one year is actually nothing, but as singles a lot of times it feels like forever and it’s not.
Before marriage the enemy will do everything he can to GET you to have sex. Once you’re married the enemy will do everything he can to get you to NOT have sex. It’s the same with marriage. The enemy wants to get you MARRIED quick so he can get you UNMARRIED quick.
It is a big deal because it’s a blended family, and that’s an added element. Marriage is already really hard work and then you’re adding more work. The more dynamics you have in your relationship the harder it is. Dynamics are a child, in laws, a biological father, a sept father, one spouse travels a lot, etc. It isn’t CAN you do it, it’s do you have CAPACITY to do it?
At the end of the day it comes down to the man or the woman you are going to marry. A huge problem that Sam was concerned about in the beginning was the other parent involved.
You don’t have to hire them, just don’t NOT interview them.
The actual issue is that at the root of many of our problems is that we’re not actually good at hiring. Don’t ever pity hire. Don’t hire because you feel bad for them or you want to FIX them.
You have to learn how to interview, and how to hire. You have to learn how to date better, how to say no better, to wait, to be in love with someone and say they’re not the best for me.
Sam Collier is the Lead Pastor of Story Church Atlanta. He is also the founder of A Greater Story Ministries which houses a nationally televised interview series and podcast called “A Greater Story with Sam Collier”, as well as a partnership with Baker Publishing which recently released his first book entitled, A Greater Story. Collier was previously in ministry at North Point Ministries, Ebenezer Baptist Church, Newbirth Church, Orange Leaders and most recently Hillsong Atlanta where he was the former Lead Pastor. He also spends much of his time sitting with leaders such as Dr. Bernice King, Reggie Joiner, Andy Stanley, Nona Jones at Facebook to name a few, discussing the current issues of the day for the sake of pioneering a new World. He lives with his wife and Toni, and their two kids in Atlanta, Georgia.
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